Back to my saga Home Sonja's Page
Last update: August 14, 2005
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The first week of November 2000 I called Vince to inquire about a 6 speed tranny.
I spoke with him and he seemed like a really knowledgable and nice guy so I ordered
a fully rebuilt 020-2Y 6 speed from him with a 4.25 ring & pinion, .71 6th gear and I
sent a Peloquin Diff. kit to be installed. he quoted me a price of $2300.00
including core charge and shipping and a
delivery time of 3 weeks. I priority mailed him a check for $2300.00 which he
promptly cashed (big surprise). I didnt bother him until about mid december at which
time I called and left him a message. after a few messages he sent me an email
informing me that my ring and pinion gearset had arrived and he would be assembling my
tranny soon. estimated time to
completion 3 weeks. Needless to say this date has come and gone. I began to call and/or
email Vince almost every day since then managing to get a hold of him only once at which
point he was very apologetic and said my tranny would be ready in a week and a half.
this was in April. After no tranny in may I filed a complaint with the Oregon
BBB which he did not respond to. They were forced to close the investigation as
unsatisfactory due to no response (visible on the oregon BBB website which I would
encourage you to do as well, it may prevent some other guy from getting boned like us).
I have phone records for all of my almost daily phonecalls to Vince to which I
havent received a reply. I have threateded the guy with legal action
through the Oregon state attorney general's office, ive offered extra money to him to get
him off his ass. I'm out $2300.00 bucks now for almost 9 months, shit I could have
had a kid in this amount of time! (the more i talk about it the more pissed off i
get). Ive been holding off on the legal stuff because I really dont want to beleive
that he's a bad guy and I hate to be a dick to folks in VW circles but I and the others
are running out of patience. I have included the other guys emails in this so that
we can all keep in touch. please call me and let me know what goes on as I have been
knocking around a quickie day trip out to Oregon myself...
-Drew
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By oneflygti:
My experience with VL was not too good. These are simply the facts/ my experience.
I didnt order a 6speed, but a simple 5speed rebuild with Quaiffe install, 3.94 install,
and magnafluxed/tempered gears.
I paid UP FRONT on Sept 29, 2000
I was quoted 4-5 days once all part were received. So I figured around 2 weeks AT MOST. I
called a month later (4 weeks!) and VL said I would have it in a week.
A week went by and nothing. So i waited, emailed, called and left plenty of messages. I
was not contacted until another 1 month went by. This was on a Thursday after leaving
plenty of messages. VL explained I would receive a call on Monday with tracking number for
2 Day shipping service (a week before Christmas). So i should have it within a week.
Nothin. I never received a call, nor received the package.
I have now been promised 2 delivery dates which had not been met. This is 2 months into
the purchase...and Im getting a little bit ancy because i never receive any returned
emails nor phone calls.
I patiently waited, called, emailed and still nothing. Finally, early FEBRUARY (note the
last time I talked with VL was a week before christmas) i sent VL a letter requesting FULL
refund along with returning all my parts...and would you believe it...the tranny showed up
at my door in less than 4 days...without receipts and without notice the transmission was
being sent. I still havent to this day received ANY receipts or papers for purchase.
Needless to say, 2 weeks after receiving the transmission my car was totalled (the trans
had not been installed yet...thank god) I called VL and actually got through. I was told
that I would recieve receipts and that the warranty would be extended to whomever
purchased the transmission because of my totalled car. I have not since talked to VL
Enterprises, nor received receipts nor confirmation of the extended warranty.
lets review...I was quoted 4-5 days for a 5 SPEED rebuild (not 6 speed) and paid up front
on Sept 29...I recieved the tranny 4.5 months later mid FEB (dont have exact date).
I emailed and called leaving plenty of polite messages spending MY money calling long
distance, and only one time received a call back.
I sent a letter requesting a full refund...not a transmission...and he sent the
transmission anyways!
Unless you live local to VL Enterprises. I do not recommend a long distance purchase with
this company. Customer service is no where near satisfactory.
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By myvwtoo (Zach Thommen) from Kalamazoo, MI:
Hey guys you can add me to the list. I have a VLE 6 speed close ratio. I love the trans.
However like everyone else i was ready to bomb VL. I'm even a dealer for him too.
He still owes me money for a pressure plate that never got sent. I've all but lost hope
for that.
total time my car was without transmission 6 months, i installed myself in 2 days. I
prefer not to think about it now.
on a side note the only way yo ucan get a 6 speed from kraftswerk or Quaife is if you
convert to O2A (VR6 Tranny), Kraftswerk stopped doing them (O2O) awhile back, and Quaife
has strictly always been O2A.
------------------
Zachie
Sick & Twisted Tuning
'96 golf 6 speed
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"I love the trans
hate the service"
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I purchased a 5th gear conversion for my original tranny (AGB), aside from taking a
while to get the part and not being able to contact Vince, everything was fine. He was
unreachable due to vacation.
Get it.....you need it for the interstate :)
Dan
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ok, I originally replied to just the poster, but I feel I should offer my
experience with VL....
I ordered the 5th gear for my AGB (before it crapped out & dad traded the FF for it)
and after I sent the money, it took a good 4~5 weeks to get it. I couldn't reach him
either. Damnedest thing too, he's there when you call to order, but NEVER there when you
want to check the status.
He will pull through though.
$.02
Dan
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My buddy here sent his parts to get 6 speed modded a couple months back and has not had
any reply as to when it will be done . He calls 5 times a day and there is never an answer
. Also leaves countless messages and Emails and
still no reply.
We are thinking a roadtrip is in order to remedy the situation with some bats in hand to
oversee the work being done .
Jasin
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Mike,
I haven't dealt with him personally, but a friend of mine did a couple of
years ago. Everything went off without a hitch and he did very good work.
Good luck -- Craig
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I really haven't heard very many good things about VL.
I remember one guy with a VL 6 speed in his GTI blowing up 6-9 months after the work got
done. VL refused to help him out at all.
Conversely rarely do you hear good things about company's, so it's possible that VL has
many satisfied customers.
I've been very happy with Kraftswerks...
-josh
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I have also heard bad things about kraftswerk where a trans self destructed right after the warranty period. I had Vince heat treat my gears, and so far they have held up. It took me a few weeks to get them back though. Overall, I am happy with the work, although I haven't had him assemble anything. The bottom line is, no one is perfect. Everyone makes mistakes, and some things are beyond their control, especially with complicated things such as this.
One gear could have a tiny crack that you could never see, but it could come back to
haunt you later. There really aren't any adjustments within the trans, just tolerances, so
it is difficult to put the blame squarely on the person who assembled it. Just my .02
Mike
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i know vince personally i bought a 79 scirocco gti ragtop from him..
He is good for buisness just kind of a slacker some times because of how much work he has
to do..
i mean think about how many of you guys know people that need work.. its only him up there
working on trannys... so i would think that it would take some time...
Chris
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I wanted a 6 speed for my conversion to cut the highway revs to a civilized level.
This is not a racing trans; thus I retained the 3.67 final drive. I found
three kits in my travels: One came out of England (I can't recall it's name) but it
was poorly reviewed by several I spoke with, including Peloquins. It wasn't really a
"kit" as such, but more of a starting point for an experienced trans builder /
machinist. The second was marketed by EIP, I think it came out of Germany, cost big
bucks, and consisted of complete set of extended gear shafts. Clearly a racing
model; not for me. The last was the VL kit. I spoke with Vince several times.
I had no problem reaching him by phone. He seemed an up-front sort-of guy.
But I was innately put off by the concept of his exchange method of providing
transmissions. Especially when I queried him on his method of examining the parts
and didn't hear the term "magniflux", which is the only tenable method for
determining if a steel piece is cracked. This point-of-view was backed up when I
found (I think from a post on rec.autos.vw.watercooled) an individual in CA who had bought
one Vince's boxes only to have second gear fail within a few hundred miles of gentle
break-in driving. Upon returning it to Vince, the box was disassembled and Vince
reported that the nature of the gear failure "proved" that the box had been
over-stressed and he wouldn't cover the repair. The guy had his box reassembled by a
local trans shop. Mike Potter, a.k.a. Potterman, of
Virtual World Parts also recommended against trying to build a lunched box ( who knows
what the problem was with the cores that Vince has obtained ). He also recommended
Peloquins through personal experience. Thus, I send my original, functional, close
ratio trans w/ 172K to Peloquins for rebuilding w/ the VL kit, and LSD, for $1800
including a 16V 5th and 6th gear. It took 5 weeks including the shipping to/from the
east coast. I discussed oil types (sythentic vs. conventional) with Peloquins and he
reported that my trans was the best high-mileage he had ever seen, i.e.: whatever I'm
doing, keep doing it. I run conventional oil and change it every 15-20K.
Peloquins complimented the VL kit. When I installed the trans I found that the oil
level port in the end plate was drilled too low. If one uses it to determine the oil
level you will have about 1/2 pint too little oil in the trans. Vince agreed to get
me a new plate but didn't have any of the correct ones at the time. I haven't
pressed the
issue too hard as I don't think its all that big a deal (as long as one is aware of it!).
I also found Vince's description of how the "frame" member had to
modified for clearance of the extension was less than complete. I had remove/install
the trans a second time to address the matter. I've put 22K on it, much of it on the
highway in 6th gear; the trans is quiet and works perfectly. I displayed the car at Bug
Out last month and heard another Vince story wherein the guy was trying to build the box
himself and
(as I recall) was complaining about missing parts. I recommended that he go to
Peloquins.
It is really rather unfortunate about all this crap; as it appears that the
design/execution of this kit is innately sound.
Regards (and good luck),
Jim
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<< If you are doing a class action lawsuit I have a buddy here who wants in on
it.
He is also up for some street justice too if you want to handle it that way.
>>
Ya know-- I understand the feeling...
I waited four months for Vince to finish my 2.0 block last year. I wasn't expecting the
long wait- but in his defense, he DID do it right...
I visited Vince at VL last week, and he was doing ALL he could to get six trannies
assembled, so he could send them off to the people who had been waiting FAR too long for
their prepaid parts.
I've been to cheerier funerals.
I really don't know what Vince's personal life is like. I couldn't make an appointment to
meet him at VL because his phone message service wasn't taking any calls. When I arrived
at his shop, Vince was outside, holding his youngest boy, and three other young Lociciero
boys were playing in the vicinity.
Vince was babysitting, AND trying to get six trannys assembled ASAP for six very irate
customers...
Vince knows he f*cked up. He doesn't point any fingers of blame at anyone other than
himself. If the Option-6 dies as a result of his inability to bring his customers on-board
as to the real cause of the delays-- that is a real shame. What VL truly needs, is a
larger retailer to buy up an inventory of these trannies-- and sell them OFF THE SHELF to
prospective buyers. Jeff
Moss (Velocity) does this with Orrell, and even though those heads are top dollar (over
2k), they are some of the highest quality work available.
Vince does good work. Period.
The Option-6 is a beautifully engineered 6 speed. I have a gut feeling that there
may not be a lot more of these made, in light of the events of the last eight months. If
you have one coming, hold on-- even though you may not realize it-- you are one of the
"lucky" ones... The rest of us may never get to buy one.
Which is a shame.
I have money for ONE tranny-- Jasin, if your friend is so (understandably) disgusted with
the wait that I may be able to buy his spot in line, please email me off list.
"Street Justice" is not the answer this time, my friend.......
Danny
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Mike, I don't understand that guy. My friend/myself had some issues with him.
We had no problems getting the trans done/shipped. We had a 2nd gear break in under 1000 miles of putting the trans in a 86 Golf w/ a 2.0 16v motor. The Trans was a 16v w/ a Quaife & a 4.25 final. Obviously the car was going to get driven hard at some point in it's life. We had been babying it (to break it in ) when the gear shattered. Vince said send it back.....we did. When he calls he says that it was because of Abuse/racing. Well what in the hell do you think someone will do with a box geared that way....pick up milk from the corner store? We did not abuse it as we were breaking in the motor still....he would not budge. So we had him send it back to us disassembled & we took the parts to get magnifluxed(sp?) not only did 2nd gear have cracks (even where the teeth were not broken) but 3rd & 5th were too....so we found another used box & checked them out & assembled & it was fine. But that was after spending $1500+ with Vince & over $1k to get it fixed in the end.
Needless to say Vince was of no help nor did he back up his parts or Rebuild he did. Quick to blame us & even offered to rebuild it again for another sum of money....I personally think he should just sell used cars since stroking seems to be his fortay ;-0
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